QUARANTINE CALL FROM SINGAPORE
Gregory Burns: US Paralympic GOLD medalist and Fine artist in Singapore
Originally from Washington, DC and today based in Singapore, Gregory Burns is a world-class athlete and internationally recognized fine artist. He has won gold, silver and bronze medals and set four world records in swimming during three consecutive Paralympic Games.
Gregory has been in Asia 35 years, and shares his unique perspective on how this pandemic might affect the future of travel and what it means to be resilient no matter your limitations.
Gregory contracted Polio when he was one year old in Israel, one of many countries he lived with parents, who were in the United States Foreign Service. He has also lived in France, Germany, The Holland, New Zealand, Taiwan, Hong Kong and on a boat in the South Pacific before Singapore. He also completed the 2006 Korea Iron Man, four half Iron Mans and a marathon in Hawaii.
After 30 years of painting, he has received critical acclaim in a dozen countries, and was awarded the 2016 Sports Artist of the Year by US Sports Academy. He and his wife have also done 24 Artist in Residence programs, creating beautiful murals while living in some of the world’s finest luxury hotels for months at a time. He has written three books, two in English and one in Mandarain, and, not surprisingly is a motivational speaker with a TEDx talk titled: The Motivation of Limitation.
If there is anyone who knows how to persevere through a crisis, and say, “Of course I can,” when the rest of the world says, “There’s no way you can,” Gregory Burns is this person. I had the pleasure of speaking with him at his Singapore studio.
episode highlights
3:20 What it is like to experience the COVID-19 pandemic in Singapore, an island nation of 5 million people who are no strangers to health pandemics.
13:05 Why everything Gregory does is about communicating a positive message. The more life we get into our time on Earth, the more we experience. And the more we experience, the more we can connect the dots of between and among areas of our lives.
15:22 When relocating from California to Taiwan in the 1980s, Gregory went from getting a little of a lot in California versus the ability to focus a lot on a very narrow world when in Taiwan. Putting minimalism over complexity, Taiwan allowed him to get clear on just five things: art, swimming, traveling, writing, and speaking.
17:05 Gregory speaks about his identity as an American despite living the vast majority of his life overseas, including being sent around China and Mongolia by the US embassy.
24:07 How Gregory decided to compete in the Paralympic Games is a story I wouldn’t have ever expected.
32:00 Gregory talks about how he ended up running a marathon in Hawaii.
37:50 How losing his corporate job at KFC (yes, Kentucky Fried Chicken!) gave him the freedom to become a professional artist full time.
41:20 How Gregory ended up semi-illegally hitchhiking into Tibet during the Dalai Lama’s birthday celebrations, and ended up camping in the forest with buddhist pilgrims.
43:50 Find out what Gregory thinks about the future of travel.
44:50 There may have been mention of binding together to fight the martians…
Links mentioned in this episodE
Facebook: @gregoryburnsart
Instagram: @gregoryburnsart
Gregory Burns’ TedX talk: The Motivation of Limitation
Gregory spoke about the history of the Olympic Triad and his work bringing the art of the Olympics back to the forefront through his work with Art of the Olympians.
Gregory won this prestigious award for his art: Sport Artist of The Year 2016
About Adventure Calls
From her quarantine to theirs, world-traveler and author of How To Move Abroad And Why It’s The Best Thing You’ll Do, Jessica Drucker, calls up travel experts to find out what they envision for the future of travel in a post-pandemic world.
Full episode transcript
Adventure Calls Episode 1: Gregory Burns in Singapore Full Transcript*
Jessica Drucker: Gregory, thank you so much for taking my call. I am very excited to talk to you. It is 9:32 p.m. In New York. And for you it is tomorrow in Singapore? Exactly 12 hours later.
Gregory Burns: Exactly how easy is that?
Jessica Drucker: Yes. That is actually one of the easier time differences.
I think the most important question to ask you to start this whole thing off is how are you feeling? Are you feeling well and healthy in the time of the Coronavirus?
Gregory Burns: Well, having just returned from California to Singapore two weeks ago, that was the daily telephone call I got from the Ministry of Health here in Singapore. I arrived back two days before they put mandatory quarantine on everybody coming in from America. But even so, even though I had slid under the wire a few days later, I got a phone call and someone said, “Hi, I'm from the Ministry of Health, and did you arrive from America or the UK on the 17th of March?”, and I said I did. They said, Good. How are you? I said I'm fine, “That's good, if you get sick, go to these hospitals. We will call you every day, thank you goodbye.” And so I got a call every day until my two weeks were over it. Yes, to answer your question, I feel great, I feel fine. I feel unfortunate.
Singapore has had a very you know, this is not our first rodeo here, that we had SARS, as you well know, and bird flu and Singapore, I mean, it's a luxury, it's a small country the size of Lake Tahoe, 5 million people you can control your borders, you can control things pretty well. And people are,they observe regulations, they are not adverse to doing what they're told to do.
As a result, Singapore early on got right on it, and they had done a great job as you know. Unfortunately, there's been a recent spike, I think people are calling things second waves or something, but in the last weeks, numbers have gone up again. And this, sadly is a number of originally it was mostly people returning students, especially returning from overseas from Europe and American stuff like that, or Asian countries, and that was originally the issue. But now it's also happening, Singapore has a lot of what we call overseas workers,and they live in dormitories, from Bangladesh, India, Pakistan, Burma, wherever they're from. And they, you know, usually male workers were working in construction. Now there seems to be a number of spiking there as well.
We're all good. We literally yesterday had interesting timing but, yesterday they put in new measures to slow this down to, as they say, break the chain, and now we are not sheltered in place so much. But most are all non essential businesses or closed schools are now closed. As of yesterday, you cannot eat in restaurants, you can take away, public transportation is still working, up until yesterday I was still going to public swimming pools, I was eating in restaurants with family and friends until yesterday. So now we have a month of this.
Again Singapore got it early on, who was very in control knew everybody and who had anything and was controlling it. You were tracked on your phone, or through WhatsApp, where they have a tracking mechanism, they got on it and with total respect. And I'm thrilled that big brother, if you will, or AI is used in this way. I mean, this is the upside of having eyes and ears everywhere. In a sense, it really works, and you feel confident.
Jessica Drucker: It is the complete opposite response to where I am right now, which is the epicenter of the United States and, I think the virus generally.
What is the mood? Because for us, especially in New York, I actually intended to start this podcast and to talk to everyone from my Brooklyn apartment under quarantine, and we honestly just couldn't take it anymore. It was so intense. The mood was so gloomy and it was very scary. And there were ambulance noises all the time. Just that was the only noise you heard. But Americans aren't used to this like you say, big brother. But we're not used to being told what to do or these masks and gloves, and that whole thing, and I wonder in Singapore, is that I'm not saying it's business as usual in Singapore, but is that there the doom and gloom the way that we feel it here?
Gregory Burns: No, not at all. In the very beginning, prior to anybody admitting that there was a crisis, and we're not going to go there. But in the very beginning, when it was starting out, Wuhan started very soon on Singapore started to react, the government on the services and people started to start taking in, the masks came out and people started to to act differently. But there never has been, and I'm not saying there isn't now, I think after yesterday's measures a little bit, it will change or has changed a little more panic, not panic but there was in the very beginning, hoarding of toilet paper and rice and things like that. Heard about that? Yeah, but the doom and gloom No, I was out just yesterday, the night before, two days ago and running around and people are now being put into line, if you want to get to the supermarket now there's a line, and you have to go in a line to the supermarket, but again, people are used to following orders and they don't they don't take it personally. It's like, Okay, we're gonna do this. Let's do it. Let's get it over that you know it's gonna be painful. Let's get it over sooner than later, and there's no doom and gloom here.
There is concern. There is, I think with these new measures, actually a little off of the concern. But you know, it has been, in a way, business as usual, but I think now it's a little less because you can't go to restaurants. They tried the social distancing or as we prefer to call physical distancing where in hawker stands, if you will, there would be a table for four people, and there would be to read X is on two of the four chairs. You could not sit there, so you had to sit and if you were in a line that would be red lines on the floor, a meter apart where people would stand to get in line to go to something. And it's just natural. I mean, people don't. What's that? There's no question. It's not, Do we follow this or not? No. We do it. And that's how it worked.
Jessica Drucker: I want to talk about your life in the before times before the Coronavirus. Um,
Gregory Burns:BC, yeah.
Jessica Drucker: BC exactly? Right. Um And then obviously I want to get to a place where we also talk about what the future of travel looks like. T you, Um but I did obviously some research and reading about you and you talk about having a big life and which, for someone like you, is that actually seems like a small way to describe your life because you have done so much. And just for a little bit of reference, can I do this? I'm going to do this. Here we go. Your parents were in the foreign service. You lived in Israel, France and Germany as a kid in Ireland and Holland. You, um, did when your parents were living in Israel, you were one years old. You did contract polio. That's correct. Which means that your legs are not as cooperative, perhaps as others.
Gregory Burns: A nice, very good way to put it. Yeah, I'm pretty. Pretty much both of my legs are Don't work very well. Polio only affects the motor nerve, so they have complete sensory, but I don't have use of my legs. But I do have enough control to use my foot on my right foot to use the gas on my Volkswagen bug. When I did driving a Volkswagen bugs up, but pretty much for the weight. From the waist down I have paralysis and then some in my trunk and a little bit in my right shoulder as well, which was very inconvenient, especially competing in the Paralympics. So
Jessica Drucker: Incredible. Um, you Let's just do this. You competed in three Paralympic Games, you have two gold medals, two silver medals, a bronze medal. You broke five world records. You were the 2016 sport artist of the year. You ran the two or you did the 2006 Korea Iron Man 7 2020 10 2011 2012 Half Iron Man's you climb mountains. I saw something about sit down skiing somewhere in my research. OK, that's incredible. Obviously, Um and that's only have, like, 1/2 of your story. You also are a world renowned artist motivational speaker. You have two books in English and, you know, just like one in Mandarin or whatever, because
Gregory Burns:I didn't. But yes, that was in Taiwan.
Jessica Drucker: So you did not, um, write the book in Mandarin just to confirm?
Gregory Burns:No, But I do speak Mandarin, and I was on. I have been on television in China, speaking Mandarin so on. That's scary.
Jessica Drucker: Okay, So all of that to say, Obviously you're a fascinating person and there's a lot to talk about, but that is your definition of a big life. Um, but why is living a big life so important to you, especially in terms of your art and what you do now creating art from this sort of perspective of having had a big life?
Gregory Burns: Well, I think is an artist. And let's say, as a teacher or a cement or or or or speak or whatever somebody who wants to, I would argue. Everything I do is about communicating a positive message. Now that message might change, but it stays. I would argue it's state positive, and it will always if I have anything to say about it will remain positive. But you long ago, when I was graduating from college, I thought, you know, I you know, one option would be a teacher, and I and I said no. What do I have to teach? And so and I think, as a teacher, uh, now I have something talk about, something to teach. Now he is an artist. I have something to express. I've lived a few lives or a few. Um, you know, I've been around the block and I have some experiences that I do think can be relevant. And I'm happy to share them. Um, so I think living a big life, it's like a diamond with more facets than you know than just one. And I think all of us, you know, the more we live, the bigger our lives, the more we experience the more we can connect dots. And I think that's probably, uh the simplest way to put it is being able to connect the dots. Being able to appreciate different things. I mean, having lived, you know, I've lived in Asia now since 1984. I came here with a San Jose State California program to study art in Taiwan in 1984 for a year, and now it's been 35. So, you know, things change. I didn't intend it to be 35 years in Asia, but when I got out here, Asia in the eighties was hopping and I could live a big life and do a lot and travel the world and make a living, doing a number of different things and adapting. And I think adapting was a big part of it. Just what's needed, you know. And I was just imprinted when I hit the ground in, you know, August 8th 1984 in Taiwan. And I saw the Taiwanese just running. They were running. They were making a living. They weren't saying, Should I have the avocado with the sprouts or the monster cheese? Uh, should I go hiking in the woods or surfing in the ocean today? They didn't have these major questions to figure out, and I'm being facetious and silly a bit, but It was my life in California of abundance and over a lot of options. A lot of great options. And I went when I hit Taiwan, it was, um there are fewer options, but let's focus on some of those options and let's do them well. So I think I went from having this Pillette three are cornucopia of experiences that I was tap dancing around all these experiences in getting a lot of a little, and I in Taiwan was then not forced to bits, thought of and decided, Yeah, I'd rather instead of be a jack of all trades bi and master of none would like to kind of focus in on some things. A few things. Let's say so. Basically art swimming, traveling, writing, speaking those became the focus is on and then being able to do those in a really colorful environment, whether that's, you know, the temples of Angkor Wat or the back streets of Lauren, Khobar, Laos Or, you know, I was in Burma way before before Ah, Hillary Clinton was there and you know, this is where you know, and I was running around China in the eighties when there were no cars there were only bicycles and had incredible experiences meeting local people in these places before. Tourism in him and before, you know, they were overrun with how they have changed is the way they have now. So, um, sorry, but long winded. But living a big life, I think, gives us more perspective. More facets. A way to connect different dots.
Jessica Drucker: Yeah. No, I mean, there's so much in there that I do want to dig into. I want to ask you though, so you Obviously You you were in Israel at one. You were in France when you were five or six. But you identify as American. I only know this because that's where your medals are from. And I don't want to say that often, but you're, uh medals are from America. But now you've been in Asia for over 30 years. So how do you identify your nationality? Do you feel American? Or how you describe what you feel?
Gregory Burns: My dad was in the foreign Service and he was a proud American. He served in the war. I mean, he was 17. He enlisted at 17 to go into the war. I'm not a warmonger. I don't believe in wars, but my dad believed in America and as an American diplomat and my dad started at the bottom. My mom and my dad, both court in the State Department. My mom was a secretary. My dad was an attache. My mom's rank and pay was higher than my dad's when he started. So let's just get this straight. My depth and diplomatic dad, if you will. Was was a worker bee. He worked and he worked himself up from being attached to being the third man. He was the political council to the embassy at the end of his career. So he made it up to the number three in the embassy, you know, But he was proud as an American, and I've never you know, I thought, Oh, I could become Singaporean or I could you know, I could be. Why don't I change my you know, and I just that the thought hasn't crossed my mind a lot because of him, because of his pride of being American and his own belief in America. And I would argue that I have the same belief in America as well. But it's been, ah, jaded in a way. But my perspective, being outside of America and watching the Gulf War, watching the weapons of mass destruction, watching things happen that I don't believe in, haven't been believed and, you know, watching has hurt that. But at the same time, I'm still very much, you know, I am American. I was, Will be. And, um, not not to say, right or wrong, good or bad, because we have our faults as Americans. We certainly do, Um, and I'm the first to admit them, And yet we have. There is optimism. There was, Let's just say we'll see after this Coronavirus if we still have it. I mean, there is a light America has been and can I hope will continue to be an American? The rest of the world is still looking for that. The rest of the world is still saying, Listen, you guys, you guys screw up, too. But you know, there's no one else that has that role that you guys that you have played in this world and again, let's not you know, I'm not gonna You know wallpaper over all of our faults, and we have plenty of them. And we're, you know, we're multiplying them as we speak in many ways, and I'm not gonna get political right now, but, uh, yes, so but I am in America. Yeah, well,
Jessica Drucker: It's really interesting, because when you live abroad as an expat, you actually become the representative for everyone else. And they ask you, why is America doing this? Or why do Americans do this? You are. You actually double down on your American distance some ways because you're constantly defining it for other people.
Gregory Burns:Yeah, and I mean, I've actually the American Embassy has sent me around China, Singapore and Mongolia, if you can believe it as a cultural ambassador, to speak to local people, not about America. They asked me to share my story, which I guess is an American story, and that's what they But you know, I was happy to do that. And it's interesting to realize that not everybody thinks like Americans. It's like, Oh, really? And you kind of get over that early on, but it's like, Well, not everybody thinks the way we do and, you know, we had the great wet, the Western frontiers and we, you know, we subject hated the Indian sadly, and we, you know, we didn't respect things. And there was this idea of the independent, um Go West, young man. Let's let's explore, let's discover And then the entrepreneurial nous and stuff like that. You know, that steal technology from England and let's make a better cotton gin or whatever. And, you know, we figured things out. We adapted, we stole, we did what we did. And we've gotten to where we've got. Unfortunately, I'm sad to say. I think we're gonna crossroads rise and fall of the Roman Empire And we you know, I'm I hate to say it, but I I see parallels and I'm not a historic
Jessica Drucker: Yeah, I mean, I think many people are seeing those parallels, and we're sort of watching it all unfold in this exact moment, which is really also a part of the doom and gloom is sort of watching how it's all being handled and it's it's Yeah, I mean, obviously, and I want to say like, I obviously know that there are people dying and people that are very sick on that is already shocking and difficult enough. And then to also watch leadership. Just, um, doing exactly what you would think he would do at this time. You know, I'm no surprises, but no, that's really interesting. And I and I were just really curious about someone who has spent so long abroad but also competed at such a high level representing their country. Like how you define your nationality. I think Americans are also very interesting because other nationalities, when they move abroad, lose so much of their previous, like their actual birth nationality. And they sort of integrate more by feeling like Americans just always, really staying American even if you blend in. And you're not like a loud roar, American, you're still you keep it.
Gregory Burns: Yeah, I'm not allowed Robert Wright And actually to be truth be told, during the Gulf War during the bush years, I was Canadian.
Jessica Drucker: Me, too. Gregory Burns: When people say where you from, I’m Singaporean, You know, if I'm in the Middle East or if I'm you know, if I'm traveling around a dodgy country. Yeah, yeah, I lost that passport real quick. So Yeah, that was just survival.
Jessica Drucker: No, definitely. I completely understand that. Okay, So I wanted to talk a little bit about what I just wanted I know a little bit about what it's like to be so excellent at sport the way that you are. I think that I can weaken, travel the world and explore deeply as much as we want. But I don't think any of us will know what it's like to be this kind of an athlete the way that you are. But it's just I want to know about the little things for a second. We have all you know when you're brushing your teeth and you get a memory and memory flashes into your mind for me. I remember my travels all the time, brushing my teeth, washing my clothes, you know, just like I remember what Malaysia was like for a second. I'll just remember certain things about my life. But you, those memories you have, at least from that decade of your life what sounds, smells. What are the small memories that you remember the most from this really exciting basically decade of your life
Gregory Burns: Which decade? 19...
Jessica Drucker: 92 to 2000. I would say when you were winning. I don't know. Gold medals. I said it again.
Gregory Burns: Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Actually, my sports career started in 77. Um, basically went to 84 until I went to Taiwan and I swam around America and around the world a little bit. But then it was again, back to Americanism, when I went to Asian 84 I kind of stopped competing because I got a life and I started to work and I followed my art in my heart and traveled around Asia a lot. But it wasn't until the Gulf War I was. I was in 1919 91 1919 98. Um, I ended up in Tahiti and I ended up joining randomly, if you will. I read Ended up joining a boat that was a 125 foot Danish lightship with an engine in it. It was sailing around the world. The boat was called the Return of Marco Polo. And there were 10 crew members on board making television documentaries about Third World countries to broadcast in Europe about a man about to educate the first World. About the third world and I met these 22 people from this boat on the jetty. One night I was painting the sunset and they were just walking around. We met and I said, What are you doing? They told me their story and I said, Well, you know, how could someone get involved with that? And they said, Well, come by tomorrow, meet the captain for lunch. So they sent the Zodiac out. They picked me up the next day. I was in Bora Bora then for the Boeri Yacht Club. They picked me up. They took me to the boat. I met the captain, met the crew and they said, Sure, come on. So the next day we sailed away and I went from We sailed from Tahiti to the Cook Islands. Penance of our island in American Samoa, Western Samoa, Tonga, Fiji, New Zealand. And then I rejoined the boat in Palau, Palau, out Philippines, Taiwan, China. And one of the main reasons I think they hired me is because I spoke Mandarin and I was good. They're going to China and they need an interpreter. They were all Danish, mostly Danish and a smattering of European. So anyway, I got my foot in the door and I did this for about a year. But when I was waiting for the boat in Palau, this was right. When the Gulf War happened, the first go for one, I would say the one that we were somewhat justified to be in...we had the buy-in of the rest of the world again. Not to say war is good, but that war prompted me to say, Wow, if America right now is doing something, what could I do to help you know to do? What positive thing could I do? And I said, Well, this silly little voice went off in my head. Here I am, on an island in the middle of the South Pacific. Uh, I could swim in the Paralympics, and I think that silly little voice Yeah, yeah. How are you gonna train? Great. You're gonna swim around the boat as your boat sails from here to Taiwan and China. Anyway, they thought I could compete in the 92 Paralympics. So interestingly, I left the boat in Hong Kong. Um, nine months before the 92 Paralympics got a job, got a pool, started training and ended up then qualifying and competing in the 92 Barcelona Paralympics. And that's that's kind of how that story happened. Um,
Jessica Drucker: That is not what I expect. That's what I mean. That's just what got you into it. It's amazing.
Gregory Burns:Yeah, but that was being American so that was Part of that was like, what it got me because of, you know, what could I possibly do as an American to move the bar forward a little bit? And that's kind of my way I thought that could be my contribution.
Jessica Drucker: Wow, that's incredible. So I want to back up a little bit, because when did you actually start swimming?
Gregory Burns: Well, I got polio when I was a year old at my mom and I were in Jerusalem. My mom brought me that my mom and dad brought me back to America, were in Children's Hospital in Washington, D. C. And the doctor said the best thing for some a child with polio would be for him to swim because he could use whatever he had. You could swim and and to swim in a warm water pool, so my There were no warm water pools in Washington D. C that we knew of at the time, except one that happened to be at the White House. And that happened to be the pool that FD. It was built for FDR. And it just so happened that my grandfather, my dad's father, who was the dean of economics at George Washing University he actually had been doing some work for the Eisenhower administration. He knew, um, Eisenhower's personal physician. He wrote a letter to him and said, Listen, my grandson contracted polio. We don't can't find warm water pools. Could he swim in the White House pool? And this is long before 9 11 This is This is 19. This is the early sixties. Got you. So this is, you know, they didn't have the security, I guess that they have now. So they said yes, and my mom and I are my dad and I went to the White House for a couple of years to swim in the White House pool, which is now boarded over and is now the press room at the White House. Underneath the pool is still there because I claim my swimming career started at the White House at the age of 345 years old. And then it ended there in 2000 when I went to the White House with the U S Paralympic and Olympic team to meet then President Clinton and shake hands. And I took a painting of mine to present it to the president on behalf of the U S Paralympic swim team. And I gave it to one of his aides. Later, when I told her my story about swimming in the White House, she took me to the press room, you know? So here I come here. And we lifted up the floorboard and looked down and there was the swimming pool that I had remembered. And now it's covered over and all the cables for the press, you know, from the TV cameras never go underneath there. So anyway, yeah, long stories.
Jessica Drucker: Amazing. Wow. So we've all seen where you swam. It's just the pressure. Incredible.
Gregory Burns: But it's There's no the pools that that and the pool is still there. It's under the floor.
Jessica Drucker: Wow, Maybe maybe one day we'll get another swimmer in the White House and they'll want to open that pull back up.
Gregory Burns: Yeah, I thinkNixon is the one who covered it over.
Jessica Drucker: Make sense. Cover ups, right?
Gregory Burns: But that's where I started. That's when I started. And then when I was 17 when I moved to California after my freshman year at Franklin Marshall College, I moved to California, started going to school, used university, California, Santa Barbara and I started competing. I met a young lady who was my coach's girlfriend, coach, and she helped me a lot. In the beginning, I, the U S u c Santa Barbara swim coach, took me under his wing. I started competing around America, start competing around the world, but I think that the not not gay to be told polio's what did it. I only have polio to blame because polio was all about mobility. You know, being denied. Something is the best way to get someone to want to do something. And I think as a kid, you know, you know, wanting to walk to 7 11 but people so it's too far to walk, I said. I want a Slurpee. How far is this several of Oh, it's too far to walk. Tell me how far it is and I'll figure out if it's too far to walk. I think mobility and wanting to get from a to B without using fossil fuels, using my own metabolism, my own body parts to get from A to B has always been a challenge and also a joy of mine. So whether it's surfing or scuba diving or taking a train through Mongolia or China across the wherever, moving on under my own steam has been my love. And Joyce, it's, you know, I've been about mobility and communication, and the mobility piece started long, long ago and it manifested in sports and I think just is like, Oh, wow, can I do that? Oh, wow. Could I do an iron man? Can I walk the Ma Honolulu Marathon on crutches? I don't know. I never tried it. Why don't I try it? So I tried and I came in dead last. They had taken down the finish line, you know, and then suddenly I was on the news because someone found me in the middle of Waikiki running the marathon and that somebody put me on the seven oclock news. And then suddenly, as I'm running towards the finish line at nine a tonight, there's a bunch of people in their front yard going Go, go, going. Where did you come from, anyway? So it was just, you know, you just do it. You don't know until you try. Right? So, um, yeah, I finished in 16 hours, and, um but it was a good race.
Jessica Drucker: That's amazing. So they had already taken away the finish line, and then
Gregory Burns:They brought it back
Jessica Drucker: And they brought it back. Yeah. Yeah. You have a photo?
Gregory Burns:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I have a video too. I've got the TV news program too. Yeah, but I think back to the point of why do we do what we do? Know why? Because we can Or because why not? And wouldn't it be cool to try And, you know, I might fail? I might not make it, but let's give it a try. And so I think that's been allowed in the sports and, you know, having different careers to remember I was in Taiwan and applying for a job in a Taiwanese trading company, is an illustrator's an artist. And I remember I had this interview with the guy and, you know, I walked in on my crutches, embraced and I walked out and we're standing by the elevator about to leave. I'm about to leave the interview, and I'm kind of sensing this didn't go very well. You know, I didn't. I didn't feel like I had the job and I'll never forget. We push the button and I'm there with the director and we're speaking. I said, You know, listen, if you want, we just give it a try. If it works, it works of a dozen, it doesn't, You know, we call it a day, and I think that's what changed the script, and it was like, Yeah, OK, why not? And I think he changed his mind and said, OK, you're hiring him. He didn't say it then, but, you know, I got the job and I ended up working there for a couple of years and really had an incredible experience designing Halloween items. I mean, who gets started to design Halloween items, but anyway, I did, but that was because I said I think it's because I said, you know, let's just give it a try. And I think that has been, you know, my my go to And, um, I think that's what has made all the difference.
Jessica Drucker: And that attitude, which I find so refreshing and I think that, you know, that's one of the messages that I would love to spread is like, just just try it. There is no reason to not try something if you want to do it. Um, that attitude is that sort of, you know, what got you from? So you have this amazing, obviously athletic past and present Not to say that you're obviously not an athlete now and I really want to get to talk about your art that you do as well. But you do have a spot right in the middle. That was a very corporate spot, I think working for C, uh, for a few years at KFC. I don't think at the counter, I think it assumed it was a corporate role and you decided not to. You decided to leave Or What's the story of how you transition from corporate? Because I think it's really important for people to know. Even if you're in a corporate job right now, you can always take the leap. But how did you end up? Sort of leaping back into the world of just being a full time artist.
Gregory Burns: Okay, well, if I might back up just just a back end back story. So I can. I told you about the boat living in Hong Kong. I was in Hong Kong trying training for the Barcelona Paralympics. I needed to get sponsorship because I needed to get money to pay for myself. Toe represents America. I got a bunch of American country sponsors. The first was K. It was KFC. KFC gave me some money. I came back with some medals, I took pictures and I gave it to the kid at KFC. And then they said, Well, we don't know what we want to do with it, But would you like to work for us? And I said, Sure, Let's try where I was born in the year, the chicken, I eat chicken, I'm somewhat a vegetarian. Anyway, I I joined KFC and then worked for them in Hong Kong and corporate communications for three years. And then he transferred me to Singapore for two years. So here it is. 1998 The Asian economic crisis. I'm in Singapore as an expat. I'm earning three times what a local person doing the same job probably would have made. And, you know, everybody is downsizing. It's a bit like what's happening now. You know, the world's come, the sky is falling. America doesn't remember the Asian economic crisis, but we do. 1998 was a terrible year and people were out of work. There were riots. It was a scary time. Anyway, they could know, they could lose one Gregory and buy, you know, and get three Thames or so They gave me my walking papers and tried as I did, too. Stay connected to the corporate nipple, which I say And all due respect, I mean, working for a corporation is challenging and that you have to do your job. The rest is kind of taking care of you. Get your housing allowance. You know, someone does your taxes. You know you don't have to buy stamps. Someone gets you your internet connection, your computer goes down, they fix it, you know? Sorry to say it, but you can get lazy. And, um So here I was literally five years to the day, having worked in this corporate embryo, if you will, and enjoying it. And I said at that time, and I couldn't get the job. The job went away. And now what? And my wife at the time And you was my girlfriend. But, you know, we were living together. Said, Well, now what I said: Well, that's why don't you just try what we try. And my older brother had said, You know why we had you never become a professional artist. I mean, I've been exhibiting for 20 years, but I had never just been a full time artist. I always had jobs, and I thought, OK, so I'm turning 40 years old, you know, lost the job. Um, people, I would love to say I gave it up. No, I didn't. I lost it. I tried to, you know, I tried to stay connected, but it didn't work. And thank God it didn't work because the universe knows when you should be doing different things and So I began working for myself, if you will. I was painting. I went back. I did my M f A and painting. Um, I started mode doing mawr motivational speaking. So I started to cobble together a life as a professional artist and a professional speaker and started to figure out how to make this work. And 22 years down the road, it works. And but the beginning stages were, of course, challenging and scary and, you know, keep your overhead low. And as I continue to do and it's, you know, you just you adapt and you figure it out. And I'm very lucky. Have support. Ah, a very supportive girlfriend soon to be wife at the time. Um, you know, we work together, we batten down the hatches. So you know, not to say I did it all myself because you know that it takes two to tango and I was in a relationship, and so but we worked it out and it, you know, part of it, I guess, is trusting and realizing that, and I think also keeping you overhead low or having saved you know, when I worked for KFC, I was like OK, My idea was I said when I left, when I walked out the door, I said, You know, if I could make the same money, I'm making a KFC as an artist in a speaker. I will have arrived and that to me, because it was plenty of money to live on. You know, I don't need to toe, you know, make gazillions of dollars. Why not just do this? And so that's how it worked out and, you know, and fortunately, it's done. I've done much better than I did it. KFC so and I
Jessica Drucker: Think you've also been so creative with, You know, at first you call it cobbling together. But it's so to me from the outside it seems so romantic to learn about your artist in residence programs that you've done so basically and I'll let you describe it. But from how I understand it, you're living in a hotel somewhere glamorous around the world and creating a big piece of art over a period of time. What a way to travel, live and paint. Well,
Gregory Burns: that was 1999 again after the crisis. A friend of ours, a neighbor in Singapore was doing the grand opening. He was the events planner for the grand opening of the Oprah or Or which island in Indonesia next to Bali, not as famous as body, but a similar island. And they were opening a massive oven or resort there, and they wanted a grand opening. And my buddy said, Hey, you should be the artist in residence at Oba Roy And I said, That's a great idea. What's that? And he said, I don't know. Let's figure it out. So it basically meant he got the GM to agree that they would invite Angie and myself to the island, to the resort. We, you know, we lived there for about six weeks. I invited my brother over and his girlfriend and I painted. I had a studio, didn't have an exhibition. Um, I spoke with guests, and basically that was the That was a win win. I mean, the resort did Well, I sold some paintings. If you know, I did some good PR for them. We had some articles, magazine articles, you know, media coverage. So it was a win win. And then, you know, I used a letter from that GM to get another residency and I'd say 40 of those later. I'm still doing it.
Jessica Drucker: And are those the highlights of your travels or what are some other great highlights that you've had up until the off the end of the before times
Gregory Burns:The end of the BC? Yeah, well, I mentioned the one, so I was backpacking across China for a couple of months. I ended play don't on which is a Buddhist site on the Silk Road and 500 caves in the mountain. Buddhist had been building and drawing and painting and sculpting caves for hundreds of years. I was there and I decided I want to go to toe Lhasa, Tibet. But it was close. I didn't realize it was closed to foreigners because they closed that you couldn't fly. And this is 1985 or 80 86 you couldn't fly in. But I didn't know any better. So I hitchhiked it. And then I got on a truck and then I got on a bus and after two days overland, I ended up in Lhasa, Tibet, and didn't didn't realize it was the Dalai Lama's birthday. So there were hundreds and thousands of Tibetans roaming the streets and in the Portola Palace. And here I was like one of nine foreigners who happened to have snuck in or managed to get lost because it was closed and that was amazing because I lived. I camped in the forest with a bunch of pilgrims. There was a group of basically Children camping next to me. There were 17. The youngest was nine. They had walked, hitchhiked, crawled whatever. From Chengdu to Lhasa, which is many days by transportation. They had done this to get to the Ali Lama started to get to Los to be part of the celebrations of the Dalai Lama's birthday. They were in a camp next to me in the middle of the night. One of these kids comes over with a skin, a can of spam, Chinese spam and because they were worried that I was not, didn't have enough to eat and offered me a can of spam. Now a can of spam to five Tibet and Children in the mountains of Tibet without a nickel to between them was worth but a lot more than a can of spam. Um, Anyway, I've had experiences like that where people have shown such love, compassion and respect to me countless times across the planet that I have never. And I will never lose my faith in humanity.
Jessica Drucker: Wow, What an incredible story. Okay, last question. What do you see? The future of travel, a za result of the coronavirus.
Gregory Burns:To answer your question point blank. People will forget this will go away, and I'm not minimizing it in any way, shape or form. But it will go away. And if we have this conversation in 1 to 2 years, I would argue that people think it will be back to normal. I hope so, Yeah. I'm saddened that we won't remember. I'm happy to report that Singapore did remember SARS and that's why they got their act to get Taiwan as well. I mean, China, you could say I'm not gonna, you know, list the countries, but people who know when the chips are down, what to do because of experience, and then act on that Bravo. And let's just hope that we learn and we act on it the next time because this can happen again. This is not a one off. I mean, you know, this is there been pep epidemics throughout history and there will be, and there will be bombing Bali bombings. And there will be the Martians that are gonna they invade the Earth. And I'm kidding, but I've always said that we need Martians to invade the earth so the weak will bond together as a human race to fight the Martians. And in a way we can use this pandemic to bind together as well as a race to work together and not work apart and try to fix us as a group as a group, think as a group, country as a global victim of this pandemic. Can we rally together?
Jessica Drucker: I am so inspired by your positivity I can't wait to share this far and wide and let people know about your story, the work that you do and yeah, just how incredible it is to know what you can dio, no matter your limitations. And so where can people find you? You mentioned GregoryBurns.com
Gregory Burns: Yeah, www.gregoryburns.com. One word G R E G O R Y B U R N S dot com. I have instagram and I have Facebook, which are both @GregoryBurnsArt, all one word? Um, yeah, that's the easiest place to find me. And I'm pretty very good at replying. If people want to contact me, I'm going, you know, I'll email you back.
Jessica Drucker: Okay. Thank you so much.
Gregory Burns: Pleasure. Take care.
*transcription via Buzzsprout’s AI transcription service. Please excuse any errors.